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jackI finally saw (most of) Twilight. I found it so-so, nothing I especially loved but nothing I especially hated (although there's stuff I probably would have hated, but I used up all my hate when people were telling me about it :)).
I find it funny that Edward is so good at some things, but after eighty years is still socially clueless and still going to school -- I guess that's partly what you get when you have to live in seclusion.
He really is a total tool to Bella, but I guess that's what you get as a teenager. It's the sort of "act deliberately enigmatic and tell her what she ought to think" that comes naturally if you think you're a superior species to someone and (somewhat reasonably) self-tasked with keeping them safe without telling them why. But the thing is, it's the sort of interpersonal behaviour that can be really enticing as long as you can both pretend that he really does know better (I certainly get swept along by people who are super-confident in conversation) but also comes off as really jerkish if you stop to think that every time he tells her what to do, he really DOESN'T know better than her if it's a good idea, and it might actally be really dangerous, but he just says "trust me" because he assumes he's right.
The baseball is awesome. It's a bit ridiculous -- what would an American teenager's ultimate fantasy be if they had lots of superpowers? Use them to be super-awesome at baseball. Not think "hey, there's a reason humans don't play baseball with a two-meter baseball diamond, it would be a better game if we spaced it out appropriately to our physical speed and strength". But it's really, really lovely to see the supernatural characters just having some fun, so few books actually have that for more than half a page every few books. And nice that they have a family at all.
Other than the film being about romance, Bella is not actually an awful character: she's a bit bland, with no other great personal ambitions shown, but there are snippets of her relationship with her friends and her parents, that are not great, but show her as a person. Something else would be a much better rolemodel for empowerment, but she chooses the relationship with Edward more than he does. She even advocates her friend persuing the boy she's interested in rather than the other way round.
Some random small observations (some spoilers)
OK, it's bad that the bad vampires want to kill Bella. But despite the Cullens' vegetarianism, no-one spends long worrying about who else they're killing. I mean, that makes sense, they are the same species, and they probably can't do anything about it, but it's a bit of cognitive dissonance that all non-Cullen vampires are serial murderers by human standards.
When I saw Cullen Sr, I was convinced he was going to be a bad guy. He seemed so smarmy! But no, he was very nice.
OK, I know it's realistic to be fooled by this at seventeen, but seriously, the bad guy who threatened your mother, he's NOT going to let her go if you turn yourself in to him. Yes, trading yourself for your mother is very romantic, but it's not going to happen. I don't blame you for going, that's probably unavoidable, but bring backup too! It's not like he's got any particular sense of honour you know about, if he tastes blood he literally goes into a feeding frenzy and can't stop, your mother won't survive.
Bella's diary is cute: oh, so world-weary for a seventeen-year-old.
Pro tip: if you're got super-strength, and are trying to stop a skidding car, you need to push on the car behind you as well as the car ahead of you, unless you also have super-static-friction[1].
I realise when you're seventeen there's no good way to get people to believe you when you say "there's a psycopath guns can't kill coming to the house, get out". But going to the house, randomly yelling at your father than he doesn't understand without even TRYING to say "you're in danger, can we get out first and patronise me later?" doesn't actually make it any better.
Also, DON'T SPLIT UP! There's six of you and one of him. Yeah, send out some people to look for him, maybe, but you know where the at least four of you should be? WITH BELLA! That's the best way to find him! Also, don't let her wander off. Also, leave Edward or Cullen Sr with her, the two you're SURE won't eat her...
[1] A surprisingly common but surprisingly little known superpower! :)
I find it funny that Edward is so good at some things, but after eighty years is still socially clueless and still going to school -- I guess that's partly what you get when you have to live in seclusion.
He really is a total tool to Bella, but I guess that's what you get as a teenager. It's the sort of "act deliberately enigmatic and tell her what she ought to think" that comes naturally if you think you're a superior species to someone and (somewhat reasonably) self-tasked with keeping them safe without telling them why. But the thing is, it's the sort of interpersonal behaviour that can be really enticing as long as you can both pretend that he really does know better (I certainly get swept along by people who are super-confident in conversation) but also comes off as really jerkish if you stop to think that every time he tells her what to do, he really DOESN'T know better than her if it's a good idea, and it might actally be really dangerous, but he just says "trust me" because he assumes he's right.
The baseball is awesome. It's a bit ridiculous -- what would an American teenager's ultimate fantasy be if they had lots of superpowers? Use them to be super-awesome at baseball. Not think "hey, there's a reason humans don't play baseball with a two-meter baseball diamond, it would be a better game if we spaced it out appropriately to our physical speed and strength". But it's really, really lovely to see the supernatural characters just having some fun, so few books actually have that for more than half a page every few books. And nice that they have a family at all.
Other than the film being about romance, Bella is not actually an awful character: she's a bit bland, with no other great personal ambitions shown, but there are snippets of her relationship with her friends and her parents, that are not great, but show her as a person. Something else would be a much better rolemodel for empowerment, but she chooses the relationship with Edward more than he does. She even advocates her friend persuing the boy she's interested in rather than the other way round.
Some random small observations (some spoilers)
OK, it's bad that the bad vampires want to kill Bella. But despite the Cullens' vegetarianism, no-one spends long worrying about who else they're killing. I mean, that makes sense, they are the same species, and they probably can't do anything about it, but it's a bit of cognitive dissonance that all non-Cullen vampires are serial murderers by human standards.
When I saw Cullen Sr, I was convinced he was going to be a bad guy. He seemed so smarmy! But no, he was very nice.
OK, I know it's realistic to be fooled by this at seventeen, but seriously, the bad guy who threatened your mother, he's NOT going to let her go if you turn yourself in to him. Yes, trading yourself for your mother is very romantic, but it's not going to happen. I don't blame you for going, that's probably unavoidable, but bring backup too! It's not like he's got any particular sense of honour you know about, if he tastes blood he literally goes into a feeding frenzy and can't stop, your mother won't survive.
Bella's diary is cute: oh, so world-weary for a seventeen-year-old.
Pro tip: if you're got super-strength, and are trying to stop a skidding car, you need to push on the car behind you as well as the car ahead of you, unless you also have super-static-friction[1].
I realise when you're seventeen there's no good way to get people to believe you when you say "there's a psycopath guns can't kill coming to the house, get out". But going to the house, randomly yelling at your father than he doesn't understand without even TRYING to say "you're in danger, can we get out first and patronise me later?" doesn't actually make it any better.
Also, DON'T SPLIT UP! There's six of you and one of him. Yeah, send out some people to look for him, maybe, but you know where the at least four of you should be? WITH BELLA! That's the best way to find him! Also, don't let her wander off. Also, leave Edward or Cullen Sr with her, the two you're SURE won't eat her...
[1] A surprisingly common but surprisingly little known superpower! :)
no subject
Date: 2012-07-16 11:28 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-07-16 12:15 pm (UTC)It's really hard to walk a line between "agreeing with whoever I spoke to last because they seemed to know what they're talking about" and "holding a contrarian position just to be difficult or make a point". I'm prone to both of those flaws, I think :)
But yeah, though Twilight is really dysfunctional as a relationship model (all the way through the post, I was adding "this bit wasn't so good either", etc, and stalking is bad), I'm not sure it's that much MORE dysfunctional than many other romances, or as dysfunctional as many non-romance bad-role-model books (eg. ones where the protagonist kills lots of people because they had a good reason).
I think it does get more critical heat than many books because it's more prominent. But I think it also gets a lot more heat because people hate something that's popular that they didn't like ("I was reading before it was cool!"), and seize on the most obvious flaw, and eviscerate it, more because they can than because they have to.
I just hope that I don't have to start defending it in conversation :)
no subject
Date: 2012-07-16 12:17 pm (UTC)[1] Apart from the "everything is a conspiracy theory and I, the author, claim publicly that all the conspiracy theory stuff is true, but you can't criticise me because it's just fiction (but it's really true in the real world really)" aspect :)